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Tony Stewart Sprint Car Game
#1
Hi All,

Thought i would share this.

https://nascar.nbcsports.com/2020/02/05/...ng-nascar/

I know this isn't a Big Ant game but dirt track racing fans will love this.
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#2
(02-06-2020, 10:55 PM)knight1981 Wrote: Hi All,

Thought i would share this.

https://nascar.nbcsports.com/2020/02/05/...ng-nascar/

I know this isn't a Big Ant game but dirt track racing fans will love this.

Sadly...  for us modders, it's no better than IRacing.  I still grieve over the fact that this Kickstarter never made it (to this day).  The things the modding community and Big Ant could've done together.   Sad   For fractions of the costs of IRacing and with far greater potential too!  We had nearly a 100 tracks in RFactor that were based on real facilities and fictional facilities, something that neither game (Tony Stewart's or IRacing) will ever see remotely close to.  We had cars from the U.S., Australia, New Zealand, etc. covering a breadth of different classes. If we wanted something that wasn't in-game, we rolled up our sleeves and got to work creating something.  We did all of that by essentially hacking and manipulating something that wasn't designed to do what we FULLY wanted it to do, just to manipulate it to get as close as we could within the constraints.  We never had the good fortune to work with someone to help us make it all that we really wanted a game to be.  To get the physics as real as we could for the purely hardcore "sim" audience while still providing an outlet for those that were looking for that gaming experience that was more fun than hardcore.  To achieve both...  to be able to create content that could be used for both.  Can you imagine?  *sigh*

The fact you wouldn't have to pay $x-amount per month, then $x-amount per car, and $x-amount per track like you do in IRacing. The service just about bleeds you dry and while it does a lot of cool things, things that definitely set the bar... it comes with a huge premium and with a relatively modest amount of dirt content.  The fact that even if Big Ant did DLC you could almost expect that there'd be a more steady stream of dirt-focused content than a big company like IRacing will where the squeaky wheels get the grease and that pushes the bigger $, bigger audience content to the front of the line.  Contending with road racing and NASCAR paved oval content is always going to render dirt to a backseat.  Adding off-road trucks and rallying also spreads it just that much thinner.  The fact that with modding tools there'd be a lot of free tracks and cars created by the community available that you'll never see in IRacing on the dirt side just would've added value on top of value.  This was LITERALLY the first time a game developer in the dirt world wanted to work hand in hand with a community of people that had made dirt racing a big chunk of what it was.  Having that ability to help with the learning curve for the less computer literate (mods could be difficult to implement as it was definitely a tinkerers deal in Heat and RFactor), make packaging/distributing things easier, make it easier to get cool content out there to more people, and to get it to people who could then race with peers in-game the way they wanted to race it (whether DTR2 easy or IRacing level real/challenging).  It was a plan that could've been incredible.

And just the fact that given the ability to collaborate...  we could get physics that likely would be better than both options.  Right now the tire model in IRacing for dirt is terrible.  There's no grooving, no siping, no heat build up, the tires don't give up if you get them too heated.  It's very canned considering the amount of $ and resources that they have as a developer.  And part of that is...  there's nothing to push them.  There's no incentive to make it better.  Modding lacks it's next gen platform to move to, and the alternatives are a arcade-style console title (that some like, some hate, some clamor for more real tracks and content) or a sort of real world sim dirt title that with the budget and resources...  is kind of dragging their feet and focusing on more profitable ventures first.

I keep hoping that at some point we can revisit this in the future.  That said, based on all of the crap that Big Ant went through from people and continues to deal with on Facebook comments from people that are nearly DEMANDING that they still make the game, I often wonder why should they even bother?  People that continually ask about it despite the fact that the Kickstarter terms were never met and the ability to make the game wasn't feasible without upfronting the costs in some capacity.  These people act like they don't know that it failed and just keep pushing things.  It's pretty pathetic and altogether tragic.  This SHOULD NOT be where we are.

I just don't know if I was them if I'd not be a bit more than jaded by it.  Then again, maybe now that the public has had a few years to stew over it, while watching the last modding platform get ancient, and has become "adjusted" to paying a ridiculous sum of $ for something that they once had with a $20-40 one-time purchase in RFactor and TONS of free modded content...  maybe they'll quit being cheapskates and open their wallets if this gets put out there again eventually?  Or maybe not and they'll stick with a canned game in IRacing or a canned game in Tony Stewart's with all of the cracks and flaws both have with no outlet for anyone to step in and give them a run for their $ or an opportunity to roll up their sleeves and tweak and poke and prod to make things better.  Without that outlet or potential to do something themselves to make it better just as modders have done for over 2 decades on e-sim dirt, they're both sort of "meh" vs. what we could truly have.  I miss making ACTUAL content, not just putting lipstick on a pig.  I miss actually being able to paint on a template for a car model that was ACTUALLY mapped well, vs. the default mapping we have to deal with nowadays.  I have a wheelset of like 100+ wheel textures for everything from a modified to a late model or street stock or sprint car that really has little use in iRacing other than on the street stock (see attached image which has my vented Real Racing Wheel wheelcovers on the #199 Street Stock).  You can't texture the wheels on any of the other dirt cars.

[Image: Toby_Hallett_199-3.jpg]

I know that if they put it up again...  I'd be in for $100+ again (I was originally thinking of pushing to $150-200 if we got close to another tier, but we never really even got close to reaching the stage to fund it to ship let alone push for any of the additional cool stuff that would've pushed me even further on funding something that would've been an enormous amount of my spare time as a content creator -- making textures and working with modelers = one of my passions as much as actually playing games if not more) just like I was on the Kickstarter the first time.  I just don't know if there's enough people with the balls to match me 1:1 there.   *sad eyerolling*

I mean the sad reality... if 13,500 people put up $20 a piece ($270,000), we would've met the requirements to get the game made (minimum was $266,000). Mind you... that's NOT taking into account people like me and my buddy Adam who had $100 in a piece, the VLR or DWD guys that many had $100 invested themselves, and some of the bigger funders (i.e. Madsen's Sprint Car team) that put in like $10k of their own $. If you really wrap your head around that... we needed like a relatively small portion of a much larger racing community to share the costs of a single large (16") one topping pizza. I mean... that's like NOTHING. And if you wanted the console version, you front like $60... get the console AND PC copy, can give the PC copy away or sell it on eBay or something, and you'd have your game and have helped fund enough for probably 3 people. It's freaking ridiculous when you crunch the #'s that we couldn't pass this and it makes US... not Big Ant... but US... look bad as a sporting community.
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Slingin FacebookMy FaceBook - Skin painter, not for hire.
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#3
I don't think anyone knew about it. If you posted about it in all of the facebook groups about Sprint Cars and even in the groups who still play WoO2002. It's a shame that game isn't easy to remaster. A great game to this day, which just needs a bit of love.

Now we have Tony Stewart, and the mobile gaming version are planning on making the jump to PC, plus the new Codemasters game will feature Sprint Cars... It's a real shame they couldn't strike whilst the iron was hot. Maybe they could still manage to find their niche within the market. An Aussie developer focusing on the Aussie World Series Sprintcars?
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#4
(07-12-2020, 05:00 PM)HaydanJames Wrote: I don't think anyone knew about it. If you posted about it in all of the facebook groups about Sprint Cars and even in the groups who still play WoO2002. It's a shame that game isn't easy to remaster. A great game to this day, which just needs a bit of love.

Now we have Tony Stewart, and the mobile gaming version are planning on making the jump to PC, plus the new Codemasters game will feature Sprint Cars... It's a real shame they couldn't strike whilst the iron was hot. Maybe they could still manage to find their niche within the market. An Aussie developer focusing on the Aussie World Series Sprintcars?

There were a significant # of media outlets that covered the game in the U.S.  I mean, it was on forums like 4m.net which is a dirt oval focused forum in the U.S. that still has a considerable # of viewers.  Ben Shelton, who worked for various print and video media companies, did his share of article write-ups along with a video promotional on Dirtondirt.com over the game's developers going back to the dawn of the Kickstarter.  Ben is not lost on dirt sim gaming having been a part of onlineracing.cc back in the Dirt Track Racing and NASCAR Heat eras of dirt sim racing and game modding.  His Mid-South Racing forum got it's start as a sub-forum on the onlineracing.cc forum site which was focused on dirt sim racing primarily and real dirt racing in the mid-south region of the U.S. secondarily. 

Various sim racing groups like Slingindirt.com (a site that I'm affiliated with, which prior to that I was also affiliated with Dirtwizard.com and prior to that TheWildchild.org which were all NASCAR Heat-focused and later RFactor focused modding developers/communities), Teamvlr.com, and Dirtworksdesigns.com (run by some of my buddies who were formerly of DirtWizard.net which was the DTR community arm of Dirtwizard.com) did promotion of it on both their sites/forums as well as on social media.  A large portion of the people that are into dirt oval sim racing were on pages like those that were some of the biggest players in dirt oval modding for NASCAR Heat, RFactor, and Ratbag Dirt Track Racing.  In fact, some of us transcend platforms as we continue to make content and add-ons for IRacing as well.  So there were plenty of people that knew of it.  

Did EVERYONE know?  Probably not.  But I think more than enough knew and didn't take the plunge.  And admittedly, I get it to a certain point.  You have to realize why dirt track game modding existed in the first place.  It started really going back to NASCAR Racing by Papyrus ages ago (when no dirt games existed), but basically really took off around the exact same time that Dirt Track Racing 2 shipped.  Which, that should throw up a red flag there if there's already a boxed game available and yet people are flocking to a different asphalt-focused game to try to get their dirt sim racing on with.

There were a # of modders in Dirt Track Racing but they were hacking things together initially with the DE2 editor and later on with using a program like Rhino3D to tweak models for in-game use.  There was a very primitive set of things we could edit and, at best, it was more manipulated than truly modded with custom models and custom content. 

But the first true custom designed models that were embedded into a game using something like 3D Studio Max took place with NASCAR Heat (the old PC-only version, precursor ultimately to Dirt to Daytona) by Monster Games Inc.  A big part of why that happened was because Ratbag Games focused so heavily on the arcade level feel of things.  Dirt Track Racing was a great unifier when it came out as nothing had come out remotely close to it prior.  That said, all DTR2 ultimately was really was a fresh coat of paint, a higher resolution texture (256 x 256 on the .tga to 512 x 512), and slightly improved polygonal models for another cost.  For many...  that $20 cost for what they got in return wasn't worth the costs of entry and they were pretty upset with Ratbag.  That isn't to say that they wanted the moon and stars for $20, but more that they were willing to pay $50-70 to get the NASCAR Racing 2003/IRacing level driving experience and much improved graphics.

And while that arcade aspect has it's appeal to a certain contingent of the dirt community...  many wrote significant letters to Ratbag during the end of the Dirt Track Racing (the first iteration) game era basically begging and pleading for them to turn the game into the NASCAR Racing 2003-level dirt oval sim that so many wanted.  Basically, they wanted the game that it took IRacing to partially deliver (and even there...  there's many not happy with IRacing's dirt experience still).  When it didn't happen, people felt jaded and decided to try to figure out how to make it themselves.  The fact that modding got as far as it even did is pretty incredible to say the least.

BigAnt, in a lot of ways, was seen as a continuation of what Ratbag was doing.  Which, as you can tell above...  if we were making a mod to another game outside of the Ratbag fray, we probably were doing so for a reason that we felt that Ratbag's game couldn't deliver on.  They weren't seen as this entity that could work to put out a suitable IRacing-level or better than Heat/RFactor level game by the communities that had by and large rallied behind the modders. 

Many of the people from the various mod communities even expressed to me, later on, that they didn't like the sounds of BigAnt relying so much on us because they felt like they were going to be riding on our shoulders for something that they felt they should be able to deliver out of the box themselves.  Like, our car models and track models were going to be this massive source of content for a group of game developers that they felt should be able to model up a late model and series of tracks on the level of what we had without needing us.  Or, ultimately, they felt it was something that they felt we could do better than with by investing our energies elsewhere (i.e. RFactor 2, World Racing Series by PiBoSo, etc.).  I get it to a point but...  in the end, we were a mod community for a reason, and that's because nobody had even remotely delivered on what we were trying to do much less see us as someone to work with and embrace.  I believed that BigAnt saw the value in us and that it went FAR beyond just a late model or sprint car car model but the massive roster of content that modding for dirt oval had produced in the past to the sheer # of quality dirt tracks we had in Heat and in RFactor.  The fact BigAnt was giving us this outlet and opportunity was absolutely HUGE and could've made for a much better game experience for ALL people.  It was something that we'd ultimately never had the good fortune of having prior.  I mean, ISI and Studio397 weren't going to kick us out of bed if we opted to jump in and romp with them.  That said, we weren't the one they had eyes for...  and it showed by how much they focused on us (very little).  What WE made happen, WE made happen and it was ultimately with less thanks to them than you'd imagine, sadly.

My outlook was always that there's no way that ISI or Studio 397 or any other game developer was ever going to give us the keys to the candy store.  We were going to be treated like any other modding community and as such it was up to us to basically scrounge, kick, and scrape together whatever we could make work and often that fell on us to basically MacGyver some crap together and see if it stuck or if it came apart in our hands.  We had gotten as far along as we had by being resourceful and figuring out how to manipulate things in ways that they often weren't officially designed to do.  A good example was dynamic tracks in RFactor that ultimately came from modding a third-party plug-in for weather in-game that we used to create track surfaces that evolved.  Even there, it came along so late in RFactor's development that most of the tracks weren't built for it and it was flaky at best in implementation when we did.  We were never going to be treated as an equal in any of those environments.  We were never going to be valued in any way other than the x # of game sales that came from us supporting their platform. 

To me...  that's why BigAnt's proposal was like God's gift and why I was a huge and ardent supporter.  I still wish for it.  I know it's probably barking up the wrong tree at this point.  I still genuinely wished though that BigAnt finally just decided it was time to take this out of moth balls and give it another try.  I don't mean by leeching on to Tony Stewart but by perhaps thinking of how to make this a profitable venture that could be seen as a marketing opportunity for a # of real racing sanctions and their properties.  Maybe ink a deal with IMCA to provide a grassroots weekly racing experience and use their likenesses and properties, then take the same game engine and refactor it to cover a Lucas Oil Dirt Late Model Series and all of it's tracks and properties.  Then maybe court a POWRi Midget Series and a Lucas Oil American Sprint Car Series (ASCS) and deliver a game on their drivers and cars and track properties.  Further, sort of like DTR2 and DTRSC could share tracks...  make all of the games operate with their tracks in a shared fashion.  Suddenly you'd have a huge array of American dirt tracks that could play across the various games.  Want to weekly race at a Portsmouth or Belle Claire or Brownstown, you can fire up the IMCA Modifieds or Sport Mods and race them there as a weekly class for state or region or national points.  Want to run a Lucas Oil race at Boone or Marshalltown?  Ditto.  For BigAnt you break the game up into a # of titles with profit revenues per title.  For a modding community, you give them outlets to fill in the gaps with series where licensing can't be met.  I mean, if USAC and World Racing Group are tied-in with IRacing, you're not going to get them in a BigAnt game.  But if a modder makes a series of UMP or AMRA or WISSOTA modifieds or a USAC Sprint or Silver Crown car...  or a WoO Outlaw Sprint Car series or late model series "mod" that's a different story.  If someone wants to build up a complete DIRTcar NE modified Super DIRT Series with the various tracks past/present, they have the power as a modder to do so and it's an additional benefit to what BigAnt is doing as it undoubtedly would sell more games.  And if that leads to BRiSCA or New Zealand Super Saloons invading the game?  Fantastic.

So...  I think in the end, a lot of this was an image problem sadly.  There were people literally going around telling people not to fund the game because it was going to be made anyway.  That was a bald-faced lie (as you can obviously see now) but...  such is how people operate, sadly.  They had heard BigAnt say that if it didn't meet the Kickstarter that they would still try to see if they could sell someone on helping fund it but that it would be much harder to do if it was done at all, and ultimately...  they took that as a guarantee it would happen either way.  Some of those that seem so demanding on BigAnt postings IMHO are those that fell into this belief that the game was happening anyhow.  The fact it's not being built they felt is on BigAnt, not on the community.  Which...  as a member of the community, I still to this day feel disappointed in my fellow dirt oval sim gamers that didn't open their wallets and at least plunk down $20 on this.  I was in for $100 myself and ultimately, was willing to go in more than that if it meant getting more of the additional content stuff.  Modding had been a huge portion of my life to that point.  For me, this was investing in a future that now no longer truly exists.

There were others that, like I said, felt like BigAnt which had came in with some PC titles that you couldn't mod and a sprint car game for XBox that many felt was subpar to the WoO 2002 for PS2 game, they didn't see a lot of point.  They felt like were being sold the same old box of canned yams and not a whole new game with an advanced game engine that was more competitive with the Unreal Engine, Unity 3D, Lumberyard, CryEngine, Source, or GMotor (ISI/Studio 397) engines we were familiar with.  They felt like even if we got our models in, what could it possibly drive like?  How realistic "sim" could it be?  Were we basically working together to produce DTR 3 and nothing more?  Again, look back to what I wrote about earlier with regards to people feeling jaded when Dirt Track Racing 2 was what it was.  The fact that we weren't getting an iRacing level sim and instead another arcade-level dirt game with slightly improved graphics.  They didn't want to invest in that future.

Reality?  We don't know what Big Ant Dirt Track would ultimately be.  We never got that chance.  I still am miffed about it because I think it was our best option going forward.  I'd love to have seen how much effort would've been tossed our way to give us what we'll never get with Studio 397 and what we'll never see with IRacing either.

One of the modders from the community, Tim Bennett...  who was behind the game mods Dirt Late Model Sim and Modified Mania and the SBS/DSI versions of the games, as well as a member of the community helping us (Slingindirt.com) on diRtFactor, actually evolved into a game publisher/developer.  His apps. Dirt Trackin' and Dirt Trackin' Sprint Cars are featured in the app stores on mobile as well as most recently on Nintendo Switch.  I think his eventual goal is to get the game on gaming consoles and PC at some point.  The downside is...  again, while he might be keen to take models created by the community and plug them in for DLC, Tim isn't ever going to be the one to give us free reign of giving someone a set of mod tools to plug in their own car models and their own physics.  Again, that's a benefit I feel that BigAnt would've given us.
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#5
(10-18-2020, 06:27 PM)SPONGEZILLA Wrote:
(07-12-2020, 05:00 PM)HaydanJames Wrote: I don't think anyone knew about it. If you posted about it in all of the facebook groups about Sprint Cars and even in the groups who still play WoO2002. It's a shame that game isn't easy to remaster. A great game to this day, which just needs a bit of love.

Now we have Tony Stewart, and the mobile gaming version are planning on making the jump to PC, plus the new Codemasters game will feature Sprint Cars... It's a real shame they couldn't strike whilst the iron was hot. Maybe they could still manage to find their niche within the market. An Aussie developer focusing on the Aussie World Series Sprintcars?

There were a significant # of media outlets that covered the game in the U.S.  I mean, it was on forums like 4m.net which is a dirt oval focused forum in the U.S. that still has a considerable # of viewers.  Ben Shelton, who worked for various print and video media companies, did his share of article write-ups along with a video promotional on Dirtondirt.com over the game's developers going back to the dawn of the Kickstarter.  Ben is not lost on dirt sim gaming having been a part of onlineracing.cc back in the Dirt Track Racing and NASCAR Heat eras of dirt sim racing and game modding.  His Mid-South Racing forum got it's start as a sub-forum on the onlineracing.cc forum site which was focused on dirt sim racing primarily and real dirt racing in the mid-south region of the U.S. secondarily. 

Various sim racing groups like Slingindirt.com (a site that I'm affiliated with, which prior to that I was also affiliated with Dirtwizard.com and prior to that TheWildchild.org which were all NASCAR Heat-focused and later RFactor focused modding developers/communities), Teamvlr.com, and Dirtworksdesigns.com (run by some of my buddies who were formerly of DirtWizard.net which was the DTR community arm of Dirtwizard.com) did promotion of it on both their sites/forums as well as on social media.  A large portion of the people that are into dirt oval sim racing were on pages like those that were some of the biggest players in dirt oval modding for NASCAR Heat, RFactor, and Ratbag Dirt Track Racing.  In fact, some of us transcend platforms as we continue to make content and add-ons for IRacing as well.  So there were plenty of people that knew of it.  

Did EVERYONE know?  Probably not.  But I think more than enough knew and didn't take the plunge.  And admittedly, I get it to a certain point.  You have to realize why dirt track game modding existed in the first place.  It started really going back to NASCAR Racing by Papyrus ages ago (when no dirt games existed), but basically really took off around the exact same time that Dirt Track Racing 2 shipped.  Which, that should throw up a red flag there if there's already a boxed game available and yet people are flocking to a different asphalt-focused game to try to get their dirt sim racing on with.

There were a # of modders in Dirt Track Racing but they were hacking things together initially with the DE2 editor and later on with using a program like Rhino3D to tweak models for in-game use.  There was a very primitive set of things we could edit and, at best, it was more manipulated than truly modded with custom models and custom content. 

But the first true custom designed models that were embedded into a game using something like 3D Studio Max took place with NASCAR Heat (the old PC-only version, precursor ultimately to Dirt to Daytona) by Monster Games Inc.  A big part of why that happened was because Ratbag Games focused so heavily on the arcade level feel of things.  Dirt Track Racing was a great unifier when it came out as nothing had come out remotely close to it prior.  That said, all DTR2 ultimately was really was a fresh coat of paint, a higher resolution texture (256 x 256 on the .tga to 512 x 512), and slightly improved polygonal models for another cost.  For many...  that $20 cost for what they got in return wasn't worth the costs of entry and they were pretty upset with Ratbag.  That isn't to say that they wanted the moon and stars for $20, but more that they were willing to pay $50-70 to get the NASCAR Racing 2003/IRacing level driving experience and much improved graphics.

And while that arcade aspect has it's appeal to a certain contingent of the dirt community...  many wrote significant letters to Ratbag during the end of the Dirt Track Racing (the first iteration) game era basically begging and pleading for them to turn the game into the NASCAR Racing 2003-level dirt oval sim that so many wanted.  Basically, they wanted the game that it took IRacing to partially deliver (and even there...  there's many not happy with IRacing's dirt experience still).  When it didn't happen, people felt jaded and decided to try to figure out how to make it themselves.  The fact that modding got as far as it even did is pretty incredible to say the least.

BigAnt, in a lot of ways, was seen as a continuation of what Ratbag was doing.  Which, as you can tell above...  if we were making a mod to another game outside of the Ratbag fray, we probably were doing so for a reason that we felt that Ratbag's game couldn't deliver on.  They weren't seen as this entity that could work to put out a suitable IRacing-level or better than Heat/RFactor level game by the communities that had by and large rallied behind the modders. 

Many of the people from the various mod communities even expressed to me, later on, that they didn't like the sounds of BigAnt relying so much on us because they felt like they were going to be riding on our shoulders for something that they felt they should be able to deliver out of the box themselves.  Like, our car models and track models were going to be this massive source of content for a group of game developers that they felt should be able to model up a late model and series of tracks on the level of what we had without needing us.  Or, ultimately, they felt it was something that they felt we could do better than with by investing our energies elsewhere (i.e. RFactor 2, World Racing Series by PiBoSo, etc.).  I get it to a point but...  in the end, we were a mod community for a reason, and that's because nobody had even remotely delivered on what we were trying to do much less see us as someone to work with and embrace.  I believed that BigAnt saw the value in us and that it went FAR beyond just a late model or sprint car car model but the massive roster of content that modding for dirt oval had produced in the past to the sheer # of quality dirt tracks we had in Heat and in RFactor.  The fact BigAnt was giving us this outlet and opportunity was absolutely HUGE and could've made for a much better game experience for ALL people.  It was something that we'd ultimately never had the good fortune of having prior.  I mean, ISI and Studio397 weren't going to kick us out of bed if we opted to jump in and romp with them.  That said, we weren't the one they had eyes for...  and it showed by how much they focused on us (very little).  What WE made happen, WE made happen and it was ultimately with less thanks to them than you'd imagine, sadly.

My outlook was always that there's no way that ISI or Studio 397 or any other game developer was ever going to give us the keys to the candy store.  We were going to be treated like any other modding community and as such it was up to us to basically scrounge, kick, and scrape together whatever we could make work and often that fell on us to basically MacGyver some crap together and see if it stuck or if it came apart in our hands.  We had gotten as far along as we had by being resourceful and figuring out how to manipulate things in ways that they often weren't officially designed to do.  A good example was dynamic tracks in RFactor that ultimately came from modding a third-party plug-in for weather in-game that we used to create track surfaces that evolved.  Even there, it came along so late in RFactor's development that most of the tracks weren't built for it and it was flaky at best in implementation when we did.  We were never going to be treated as an equal in any of those environments.  We were never going to be valued in any way other than the x # of game sales that came from us supporting their platform. 

To me...  that's why BigAnt's proposal was like God's gift and why I was a huge and ardent supporter.  I still wish for it.  I know it's probably barking up the wrong tree at this point.  I still genuinely wished though that BigAnt finally just decided it was time to take this out of moth balls and give it another try.  I don't mean by leeching on to Tony Stewart but by perhaps thinking of how to make this a profitable venture that could be seen as a marketing opportunity for a # of real racing sanctions and their properties.  Maybe ink a deal with IMCA to provide a grassroots weekly racing experience and use their likenesses and properties, then take the same game engine and refactor it to cover a Lucas Oil Dirt Late Model Series and all of it's tracks and properties.  Then maybe court a POWRi Midget Series and a Lucas Oil American Sprint Car Series (ASCS) and deliver a game on their drivers and cars and track properties.  Further, sort of like DTR2 and DTRSC could share tracks...  make all of the games operate with their tracks in a shared fashion.  Suddenly you'd have a huge array of American dirt tracks that could play across the various games.  Want to weekly race at a Portsmouth or Belle Claire or Brownstown, you can fire up the IMCA Modifieds or Sport Mods and race them there as a weekly class for state or region or national points.  Want to run a Lucas Oil race at Boone or Marshalltown?  Ditto.  For BigAnt you break the game up into a # of titles with profit revenues per title.  For a modding community, you give them outlets to fill in the gaps with series where licensing can't be met.  I mean, if USAC and World Racing Group are tied-in with IRacing, you're not going to get them in a BigAnt game.  But if a modder makes a series of UMP or AMRA or WISSOTA modifieds or a USAC Sprint or Silver Crown car...  or a WoO Outlaw Sprint Car series or late model series "mod" that's a different story.  If someone wants to build up a complete DIRTcar NE modified Super DIRT Series with the various tracks past/present, they have the power as a modder to do so and it's an additional benefit to what BigAnt is doing as it undoubtedly would sell more games.  And if that leads to BRiSCA or New Zealand Super Saloons invading the game?  Fantastic.

So...  I think in the end, a lot of this was an image problem sadly.  There were people literally going around telling people not to fund the game because it was going to be made anyway.  That was a bald-faced lie (as you can obviously see now) but...  such is how people operate, sadly.  They had heard BigAnt say that if it didn't meet the Kickstarter that they would still try to see if they could sell someone on helping fund it but that it would be much harder to do if it was done at all, and ultimately...  they took that as a guarantee it would happen either way.  Some of those that seem so demanding on BigAnt postings IMHO are those that fell into this belief that the game was happening anyhow.  The fact it's not being built they felt is on BigAnt, not on the community.  Which...  as a member of the community, I still to this day feel disappointed in my fellow dirt oval sim gamers that didn't open their wallets and at least plunk down $20 on this.  I was in for $100 myself and ultimately, was willing to go in more than that if it meant getting more of the additional content stuff.  Modding had been a huge portion of my life to that point.  For me, this was investing in a future that now no longer truly exists.

There were others that, like I said, felt like BigAnt which had came in with some PC titles that you couldn't mod and a sprint car game for XBox that many felt was subpar to the WoO 2002 for PS2 game, they didn't see a lot of point.  They felt like were being sold the same old box of canned yams and not a whole new game with an advanced game engine that was more competitive with the Unreal Engine, Unity 3D, Lumberyard, CryEngine, Source, or GMotor (ISI/Studio 397) engines we were familiar with.  They felt like even if we got our models in, what could it possibly drive like?  How realistic "sim" could it be?  Were we basically working together to produce DTR 3 and nothing more?  Again, look back to what I wrote about earlier with regards to people feeling jaded when Dirt Track Racing 2 was what it was.  The fact that we weren't getting an iRacing level sim and instead another arcade-level dirt game with slightly improved graphics.  They didn't want to invest in that future.

Reality?  We don't know what Big Ant Dirt Track would ultimately be.  We never got that chance.  I still am miffed about it because I think it was our best option going forward.  I'd love to have seen how much effort would've been tossed our way to give us what we'll never get with Studio 397 and what we'll never see with IRacing either.

One of the modders from the community, Tim Bennett...  who was behind the game mods Dirt Late Model Sim and Modified Mania and the SBS/DSI versions of the games, as well as a member of the community helping us (Slingindirt.com) on diRtFactor, actually evolved into a game publisher/developer.  His apps. Dirt Trackin' and Dirt Trackin' Sprint Cars are featured in the app stores on mobile as well as most recently on Nintendo Switch.  I think his eventual goal is to get the game on gaming consoles and PC at some point.  The downside is...  again, while he might be keen to take models created by the community and plug them in for DLC, Tim isn't ever going to be the one to give us free reign of giving someone a set of mod tools to plug in their own car models and their own physics.  Again, that's a benefit I feel that BigAnt would've given us.

It's great to read that someone actually gave making their own game a crack! I have the DTSC on my phone and was quite thrilled when they said they had planned on bringing it to PC...

Most game engines are free, some 3D software is free, so power to 'em for having a crack. There are some talented individuals out there who deserve to see if they can make their vision become reality.

You've now got two iterations of Tony Stewart dirt games and with Sprint Cars being added to the new Dirt 5 game by Codies, dirt might have a bright future... Such fantastic racing...
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